Sharachchandra Lele - Session 02, 2022-12-04

(00:01:14) Developing an understanding of and interest in the environment Sharachchandra Lele highlights several key turning points in his life that shaped his understanding of the environment. These include attending a nature camp during the 12th standard, encountering the State of India’s Environment report during his IIT career, and participating in an interdisciplinary programme at University of California, Berkeley [Archivist’s note: Lele refers to it as State of Environment report, but the summary has the official name]. His upbringing in a family that engaged in intellectual discussions, his dislike for biology in school, and the influence of his engineering background also played a role in his trajectory. Unlike many of his peers who focussed on engineering-related environmental fields, Lele’s exposure to forestry and conservation and Madhav Gadgil at the Indian Institute of Science (IISc) led him to pursue a PhD that incorporated forest ecology and household economics. His continued interest in wider environmental questions, including water, energy, and climate change, is balanced with a persistent focus on forest-based livelihoods and sustainable development.

(00:06:47) Academic and research journey, including ecological aspects of forest use and hydrology Lele describes his academic and research journey, focussing on his thematic areas of study and the evolution of his research interests. He initially transitioned from electrical engineering to environmental studies, with a specific focus on energy conservation in lighting. This led him to pursue a Master’s thesis in hydropower and its environmental impacts, combining technology and water energy interface. During his PhD, he explored the ecological aspects of forest use, such as degradation, defining it, and understanding its presence or absence in different villages. Lele’s post-doctoral research expanded towards studying the role of property rights in forest usage across Karnataka Western Ghats. He also collaborated with Kamaljit Singh Bawa on enterprise-based conservation in the BR Hills. He also delved into the hydrological impacts of forests, particularly in the Indian context, with Madhav Gadgil, and aimed to fill the gaps in knowledge surrounding this topic. He mentions building an interdisciplinary project on the hydrological impacts of forests for the National Institute of Hydrology and United Nations Educational, Scientific and Cultural Organisation-Intergovernmental Hydrological Programme (UNESCO-IHP) from 2003 to 2007 which included collaborating with Jagdish Krishnaswamy from Ashoka Trust for Research in Ecology and the Environment (ATREE). He learned about field hydrology for the first time.

(00:17:21) Watershed development research His research expanded beyond forests to encompass watershed development in drier parts of the country. In this regard, he mentions KJ Joy and Suhas Paranjape from Society for Promoting Participative Ecosystem Management (SOPPECOM) as visiting fellows to the Centre for Interdisciplinary Studies in Environment and Development (CISED). He examined the implications of artificial recharge measures on infiltration, soil moisture retention, and agricultural practices. He discovered the importance of considering the social and technical contexts when analysing the effects of forest management or watershed development on hydrology.

(00:20:21) Focus on urban environments and urban water management

Additionally, Lele recognised the need to shift focus to urban environments due to the environmental challenges faced by rural areas. He acknowledged the disconnect between urban and rural perspectives on sustainability and questioned the notion of urban researchers preaching to rural people about sustainable resource use. This led to his involvement in projects exploring urbanising basins and urban water management, particularly in the case of Bangalore, which heavily relies on distant water sources and groundwater. Lele expresses concerns about unsustainable water management practices in Bangalore, such as excessive energy consumption for water pumping and the proposed construction of a dam that will submerge pristine forests in the Cauvery Wildlife Sanctuary. He emphasises the need to address these issues and prioritise local water sources and sustainability in urban water policies. The urbanising basins project started in 2012 and received support from the International Development Research Centre (IDRC) for a four-year interdisciplinary study. The team at ATREE consisted of individuals from different backgrounds, including Bejoy Thomas, a development economist, Veena Srinivasan, a hydrologist with training in economics, and Priyanka Jamwal, a water pollution expert. Collaboration among team members helped build a strong understanding of the research question. Before 2012 itself though, Lele noticed changes in rural landscapes and people’s desire to move away from agriculture towards urban industrial sectors.

(00:29:47) Environmental justice concerns He had struggled with the question of equity in his dissertation and realised that access to forests was inequitable, favouring those who already had areca nut plantations. Subsequently, examining forest rights allocation revealed inequities across landscapes. Lele also observed the limitations of reducing environmentalism to sustainability and the need to consider justice and equity. Looking at environmental economics more closely over time, he realised that it framed pollution issues in terms of efficiency rather than fairness. He questioned the narrow focus on sustainability and the exclusion of justice concerns. Over time, he explored the intersection of caste, class, gender, and environmental issues and the multiple layers of injustice. Environmental injustice, he found, often correlated with social injustice, with marginalised communities being disproportionately affected and he cites the Narmada project as an example. For Lele, engagement with issues of mining and dams highlighted the widening gap between those discussing justice and sustainability. Political ecology emphasised justice, while sustainability often ignored it. He touches upon conservation efforts being driven by personal well-being and concern for non-human beings. He emphasises the importance of considering ethics, values, and justice in environmental discussions beyond just sustainability.

(00:46:34) Rethinking Environmentalism and different work landscapes In 1994, soon after his dissertation, Lele wrote a short piece for the Pacific Institute’s newsletter. This led to the book “Rethinking Environmentalism” in 2018, which explored conservation, justice, and sustainability. Lele shares that his work initially had been primarily focussed on specific regions like Karnataka and the Western Ghats due to strategic considerations and accessibility issues. Language also played a role in his interdisciplinary work. However, his involvement with the implementation of the Forest Rights Act in 2010 allowed him to explore regions like Madhya Pradesh and Jharkhand, where forest rights and degradation were pressing issues. He realised the need to shift his focus to central India, where deprivation, marginalisation, and lack of forest rights were prominent. He attempted this transition in 2012, but got sidetracked by other projects. After completing a water project, he had the opportunity to return to community forest rights work in central India. He shares that he has also conducted work in the Himalayas as part of community-based natural resource management. Despite the desire to work in diverse landscapes, physical limitations like time constraints impact his choices.

(00:51:02) Environmental decision-making and engagement with different sectors and policy spaces Over time, Lele’s engagement with environmental decision-making has increased, driven by his applied research and the opportunity to make a difference. He has observed the decision-making process since his PhD days, starting with discussions on forestry projects in the Western Ghats in Uttar Kannada. As his work expanded to the water sector, his interactions expanded to different agencies and ministries. He notes differences between sectors, such as the presence of social science research being more prevalent in the forest sector compared to the water or pollution sector, and the understanding of hydrology and civil engineering required in the water sector. He points out how his engagement in policy spaces has varied depending on the sector and his expertise.

(00:59:35) Knowledge production and disillusionment with academia Lele reflects on the academic space and the disillusionment he experienced. He entered academia with the intention of producing knowledge for change, but found that the focus was primarily on publications and citation metrics. The rat race of publishing and the pressure to meet specific criteria for promotions and selection, coupled with the realisation that academia values quantity over substance led to a sense of disillusionment. This realisation has made him lean more towards activism and prioritise creating change over conforming to academic norms. However, he acknowledges the importance of knowledge production while expressing concern about the current state of academia.

(01:01:52) Approach to his work- temperament, frustrations, preferences, etc. He reflects on his temperament and how it affects his response to criticism and discomfort. He says he thrives on being challenged and has a willingness to learn new things, even if it means plunging into a subject without a complete understanding. He emphasises the importance of asking core questions and focussing on the essence of a subject, rather than getting lost in the details. He talks about the value of interdisciplinarity, and he sees being challenged by others as a fortunate opportunity for growth. He also discusses the frustration he faces in the policy and action space, particularly in dealing with bureaucracy and the lack of meaningful debate. However, he finds satisfaction in working on the ground and collaborating with activists to make a positive impact, despite the challenges of partnering with civil society groups. [01:05:08 - 01:05:14 - Restricted Access. Contact archives@ncbs.res.in for details]